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Message |
    
Hotwire
Senior Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 2220
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Monday, May 21, 2007 - 8:26 am: | 
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Hey guys let me know what you think OK? Alright now, In the Hotwire Mobile I have been using the RG-213 that Copper sells, 20 feet in fact including the jumper.
Thinking about upgrading to 20 feet of Copper's Altelicon CA-400.
With the much better specs of the Altelicon at 20 feet of length does anyone think it will make much of a difference in performance? Give me some feedback fellas, good idea to use it in the mobile? 73
Kenny
cef491(27.115lsb)
2sf491(27.555usb)
Indiana
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Jameslarson
Intermediate Member
Username: Jameslarson
Post Number: 383
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Monday, May 21, 2007 - 10:14 am: |
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Hey there. It may help slightly better with any noise issues you may have. As far as performance, yes, I suppose theoretically, on paper, you would have a 'slight' increase in performance. However, would it be justified in buying the cable at only 20 feet? Possibly.
However, one big thing that I don't like this cable for is the fact that it has a center conductor that is solid, as opposed to stranded. And we all know that especially in mobile applications there is alot of vibration, and plus we want cable we can bend with more forgiveness than solid conductor gives. If it were me, I would use 9913 flex. But again, at 20 feet, the 213 you have isn't bad at all. |
Wildrat
Senior Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 1292
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Monday, May 21, 2007 - 11:38 am: |
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My personal opinion is that in a mobile any quality coax is suitable unless you are running some unGODly amount of power. That said if I ran across some coax at a fair price and I was feeling frisky I might change it out, would I see or hear a difference? would anyone else? probably not. Save your money. The 213 will still be good for that not unless it's a great big one.
WILDRAT
Mark
27.285MHZ
CEF674
CVC029
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Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 3740
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, May 21, 2007 - 11:50 am: |
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kenny....james hit it pretty much on the head. however, 9913 flex has a bit more loss then regular 9913. 20' @ 27 mHz, well, the difference would NEVER be noticed. the only reason to upgrade to ca400 would be for the double shield. will it help? if you are receiving noise through the coax, OR, emitting rfi through the coax, well, it couldn't hurt! i do use 9913 in my mobile, & double shielded rg8x from radio to amp. does it help me? i am 100% positive it helped with idiot light issues, wipers that i thought had a mind of their own, a cruise control that shut itself off at about 150 watts PEP, etc.
if you have ANY of these issues, go for it, if not, wait til it REALLY needs replacement! |
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 883
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Monday, May 21, 2007 - 8:48 pm: |
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well im a firm believer in antenna and coax is
the most important part of a radio station
weather it be base or mobile.so absolutely id
upgrade.however being ya got rg213 already
i wouldnt get in a big hurry for it.now on
other hand if all ya had was rg8xgray or rg58
then definately upgrade now.but i agree with pat
with the rf problems
dale/a.k.a.hotrod
cef426
cvc#64
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Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 793
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 22, 2007 - 10:13 am: |
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20ft -no you would not notice any difference at all. The loss over 20 ft of 213 is negligable and swapping to a better grade of coax is not going to make any observable difference.
Heck except for overheating by too much power you would not notice any drop in performance if you switched to 20ft of RG58.
At 20ft the cables have the following losses(at 400MHz): - RG-58: 2.34db, RG-213/214: 1.1db, 400: 0.54db. Seeing as how the smallest amount you ears can differentiate is 3db changes and it takes (usually) 6db to notice it on an S-meter, why go to the extra expense??
Simon
Tech237
KD7IEB
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Hotwire
Senior Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 2221
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 22, 2007 - 11:13 am: |
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Thanks guys! Well I'n not in a real big hurry. I do have an idiot light issue, something with my abs wheel speed sensor.
I have 50 feet on the way. Made a little extra cash and always wanted some.
Gonna switch antenna mounts. I believe I should be using my Predator lug mount instead of a SO239 mount. As soon as the paint cures on the new mount I will give the coax a try.
The way I look at it is, If I'm doing something I love to do I may as well go all out with it if I can afford the exspense.73
Kenny
cef491(27.115lsb)
2sf491(27.555usb)
Indiana
|
Wildrat
Senior Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 1296
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - 12:04 pm: |
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If you have it use it if that's what you want. Make sure you have everything grounded good. Body to frame in a couple of four spots front and back, hood to body to frame in a couple of spots, engine to to body to frame- I did this one on both sides of the engine. I also ran extra grounds from the battery to the various points. I also ran more positive wires to the things the pos wire went to, like the alternator, fuse block etc.
It is a bit of work but since I have been doing this to the last couple of vehicles I've played with and I know it has helped. I also notice that adjusting SWR seems easier. Oh well, Hotwire as always do what ya gotta do and even do those things you don't want to do.
WILDRAT
Mark
27.285MHZ
CEF674
CVC029
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Hotwire
Senior Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 2222
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - 12:05 pm: |
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Update
Gonna stay with the rg213 and use the ca400 on the Imax.
I ordered 50 feet of Copper's rg213 and 50 feet of Altelicon ca400.
Holding the 2 rolls in each hand one would think that the rg213 was better. The rg213 is like 3 times the weight of the ca400 and a much softer rubberlike outer jacket.
The ca400's outer jacket is like steel! It is really tough! Somewhat flexible but not even close to the rg213's flexibilty.
Going to solder ends on the ca400 this weekend and I feel that it will be a challenge compared to soldering ends on the rg213 which I was suprised how easy it was to work with.
The ca400 will work in the mobile and probably really well but I think after time it may cause problems with wear and tear and temperature extremes inside a mobile. The rg213 is much more durable.
Don't get me wrong now! The ca400 is top of the line stuff. It just belongs on a tower.
Kenny
cef491(27.115lsb)
2sf491(27.555usb)
Indiana
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Marconi
Advanced Member
Username: Marconi
Post Number: 714
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - 5:20 pm: |
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Get your 11 meter mobile setup right and unless you are running some heavy power, I don't even think using RG8x mini or maybe even RG58 would really make a big difference in a mobile. |
Jameslarson
Intermediate Member
Username: Jameslarson
Post Number: 384
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - 9:27 pm: |
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I would go with double shielded 9913 flex. You get great cable. Flexible. Double shielded, etc... Yes, maybe the loss per foot is "slightly" worse than 400, but it has a stranded center, and is double shielded. Just my thoughts. |
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 2536
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 24, 2007 - 12:31 am: |
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hey kenny,
wassup bro?
i like the new van!
to me, the biggest difference you can make as far as "getting out further" goes, is to get or make a whole bunch of grounding straps and spend about 8-10 hours in the van grounding each and every panel to eachother, and all that good stuff.
you now have the best DX vehicle known to man, use it to its fullest capabilities.
seriously, if you havent done it yet, you might even see an S unit or two on a local's receiver!
just my opinion,
later,
matt
anyone wanting a "clean signal", just look to the left and build one of these!!!
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Jameslarson
Intermediate Member
Username: Jameslarson
Post Number: 385
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, May 24, 2007 - 9:27 am: |
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One word of caution Howtire on grounding. Me and you have almost identical vehicles. I grounded my front swing up hood, and the SWR's jumped up to 1.7. Now whether that is what it always was and is now simply showing that, who knows. The good news is that after real careful inspection, pretty much the entire box of the van is already connected as one big piece except for the doors, front swing up hood, and the exhaust system. |
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 893
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 24, 2007 - 8:06 pm: |
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well in his case having rf problems id highly
think that double shielded coax would help this
along with some grounding.considering
antenna
coax
is the MOST important part of a cb station i never skimp on coax or antenna.
dale/a.k.a.hotrod
cef426
cvc#64
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Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 13759
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 24, 2007 - 9:38 pm: |
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Hotwire,
In your mobile installation with such a short run of only 20' I honestly doubt that you would be able to notice or detect any measurable difference between the RG-213 and the Altecon CA-400.
Lon ~ Tech808 ~ N9CEF
CEF#808 ~ CEF HAM#33 ~ CVC#002
Tech808@copperelectronics.com
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Hotwire
Senior Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 2225
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 25, 2007 - 9:55 am: |
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Hello Lon, Thanks for your input sir. I understand and I agree with you. You know how some of us radio nuts can get at times! 
Dale, I totally agree. A serious DX'er should never skimp on coax. Looking for a 9913 flex hookup now!
James, Yep! The van is pretty much one big piece of metal minus the doors. One thing I have done and I sure it has made an improvement performance wise was using one foot 2 gauge cable to ground the negative batery post to the side body or corner panel. So whatever good it is grounded to the frame I'm also grounded electrically at the body. I have RF grounded the back doors so all I really have left to do is the sides. Still have stuff to do, hopefully this weekend I can install my lug mount Predator mount and get rid of that so239 Wilson mount.
Matt!!! Whats sappening Holmes! Hey thanks for the van flowers. Your right it sure is one DX machine! In fact the reports I have been getting from other DXers are like I'm killin their local mudducks, plugging ears and putting citys on LOCKDOWN! For real man, I not bull stuffin ya! One day I made a little noise on the bowl down south until C.C. in Texas shut everyone down. Man I really took my time too! I wanted a van for a long time, almost bought an old Suburban with a big ol 454 motor but once I laid eyes on the van with the Chevy 350ci and all that groundplane plus the greenbacks left over I was in love. The motor is strong,body built like a tank! The air conditioning system is totally removed, I never use air anyway. all that is there is the compressor I am just dying to remove it and if possible install a dedicated Leece Neville so I can go get that new Texas Star 10 pill. 10 pill is my limit. Who needs more than 2 driving 8-2879 anyway? So to prepare for that day
grounding like you have advised is underway. Need to find a roll of braid somewhere.
Oh yeah since I got hold of your ear or eyeball actually....been getting lots of DX from the southwest this week, New Mexico, Arizona, Mexico and then it goes north. Of course I hear Texas like everyday even when there is very little conditions. Last time we made a contact was like years ago seems like! Listen for the Hotwire Mobile on that end!
Man is this post long or what?
Kenny
cef491(27.115lsb)
2sf491(27.555usb)
Indiana
|
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 3748
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 25, 2007 - 7:32 pm: |
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marconi....you are correct when using nominal power. my '99 computer-ized dodge durango did NOT agree with 1-mrf455 transistor & rg58 coax! an upgrade to some HEAVY red-coated rg8x eliminated all RFI troubles with 50 watts. at about 200 watts carrier, troubles were as earlier with 50 watts PEP. 9913 on a triple MAGNET MOUNT flashes the 'liftgate open' light at about 600 carrier. no other issues at 1kw carrier. so, performance-wise, maybe no difference, ability to actually USE the vehicle, big difference. |
