| Author |
Message |
    
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2035
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 1:05 am: | 
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Tech 833 i have a I-10k on my tower.
In the past 2-3 months i've been coming
over my neighbors phones, police scanners,
Tv's (Satellite). This is running just
2 1/2 Watts out of radio. I've tried 3 different
4 watt radios with same results.
I mounted a Top One in the yard about 8ft off
ground to ring, to talk local until i can
bring tower down. Same results with Top One
in yard. Causing problems to close neighbors.
Could be that's it's just not high enough.
I've done all i can with grounding equipment,
except lay some Horz radials under the ground
for RF grounding as per the other thread.
Will do that tomorrow.
I do not cause any RFI problems to my home.
Both neighbors i'm having trouble with are
roughly 30 ft from I-10K/Tower.(45ft to feedpoint)
Roughly 30ft from Top One in yard at 8ft to ring.
I'm seriously thinking of putting the Top One
on the tower when the cold weather breaks to
try it. I have new LMR-400 coax here waiting
for when i drop tower to replace other coax
which is Belden 9913 flexible coax.
And of course i'll have everything grounded good.
I put up the I-10k last October and had no serious problems until these past 2-3 months.
Also had same issues with using a Imax 2000,
A-99, Big Stik. I'm truly just baffled!
And i mean baffled! Again this is happening
with using just 2 1/2 watts from radio. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 12573
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 1:25 am: |
|
#1 ~ Is Antenna GROUNDED to Mast Pipe via ground strap or copper wire?
#2 ~ Is MAST Pipe GROUNDED to Tower via ground strap or copper wire?
#3 ~ Is Coax Grounded by means of Poly-Phaser (if used) to the Single Point Ground mentioned below?
#4 ~ Is every Meter, Power Supply, Radio, Amp, Antenna Switch's, Rotor Box (if used) ALL grounded to the same Single Point Ground as the Antenna, Antenna Mast Pipe, Tower and Poly-Phaser if used?
#5 ~ If you have done all of the above DOUBLE check to make sure that one of the ground wires are not broken or corroded to the point they are not making a good contact/ ground.
Hope this help's and the answers to the above questions will also help Tech833 if all of the above is 100% ok.
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9CEF
CVC#002 |
Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 662
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 9:50 am: |
|
Out of curiosity, what about your own TV etc? |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1552
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 11:08 am: |
|
O.K., at this point, I would rule out installation as the problem, I would find out what changed.
If you are absolutely CERTAIN that the problem never happened before 3 months ago, then you only need to find out what is different between then and now. Either your station (less likely), or your neighbors (more likely), or the surroundings.
Coming though your neighbor's scanner and satellite TV are really unusual. First thing I would check is your neighbor's AC ground. Next, I would check with your neighbor about what else might be plugged in at their house when the problem began. SOMETHNIG is absorbing your RF in quantity and distributing it within your neighbor's home. He may have a 'tuned length' of AC wiring or cabling somewhere.
Let us know. |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 3436
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 11:25 am: |
|
i generally don't touch my own stuff. when i had a neighbor suddenly get serious tvi from me-having never had more then some fuzzed pictures, & not even realizing i was using a radio as often as i do for the entire 15 years he lived next door-it turned out he ran an old (ANCIENT) piece of rg59 with 2 splices to achieve 100+', underground AND a radio shack cable tv signal booster. needless to say, 20 watts on 6 meters obliterated his TV pics, & 150 from my ar3500 was interesting to say the least. his TV's before his daisy-chained split were fine. those after, were not so good. some rewiring with quad cable, removal of the splitter mess, & removal of the booster have all but eliminated the problem. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2036
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 11:45 am: |
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I do nothing to anything in my own house.
Even with the Top One in the yard at only
8ft off ground, go over nothing here.
I even tried 60 watts DK and still go
over nothing here.
But, 2 1/2 watts DK is killing my two neighbors
which are on each side of me. About 30 ft from
either antenna.
I have another neighbor who is about 40 ft
from Top One at 8ft and i don't bother his stuff either. Or any other person on the block do i bother. My Swrs on each antenna are 1:1:1 |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2037
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 11:54 am: |
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I'll check into all that Tech 833. |
Hollowpoint445
Senior Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 1439
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 7:01 pm: |
|
If other neighbors are not having problems, I'd suggest you witness the interference yourself before doing anything. Let us know what you witness yourself, not what your neighbors tell you that they've seen. I'll be the story is different then.
It sounds suspicious to me that some neighbors have an issue, and others don't - especially if they have similar electronics. The fact that someone's scanner is having a problem is really suspicious. Even REALLY cheap scanners have filtering in the front end which should keep out interference from bands other than your operating band.
What frequency are they monitoring when they get the interference? The only bnad I could imagine interference to would be VHF low, because that would mean the scanner might be using the correct bandpass filter, one that allows 27MHz to pass as well. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2039
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, December 23, 2006 - 11:47 pm: |
|
I loaded the same scanner frequencies in my
scanner that they are using. I tried and
tried to come over my radio shack scanner
and i can't. Even hooked up a long drag
cord and moved scanner around outside. Nothing!
Even put out higher watts to try and overload scanner.Nothing! Didn't bother it. While outside i
layed the scanner by each of there houses.
Nothing! LOL...
I will see for myself what's going on with
there equipment inside there homes. Thanks
for the advice.
Both neighbors have Bearcat Scanners as i
copied what Freqs they used and loaded mine
the same. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2040
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, December 24, 2006 - 1:26 am: |
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I Temp hooked up a Horizonal dipole in
my attic to talk to the locals.
Until i figure this all out.
Haven't heard any complaints on the dipole
yet from neighbors. |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1556
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 24, 2006 - 11:32 am: |
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Hook your scanner to their antenna and power supply. See what happens. If your scanner isn't bothered, kindly tell your neighbor to repair theirs and 'their' problem will go away.
BE SURE to document your experiment so that when your neighbor notifies the FCC, you have some proof that it is not you, it is them. The letter the FCC sends complaintants to notify them that it is their problem is hilarious! |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2047
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 25, 2006 - 3:41 pm: |
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Ok, Tech 833...Will do. Thanks.
Right now i'm running a Horizonal Dipole
in attic. No complaints yet. |
Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 663
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Monday, December 25, 2006 - 5:03 pm: |
|
If you are not upsetting the gear in your house, I'd say that it is most likely problems with their installations. They have either changed something or their ground or sheilding on the coax has broken.
Have a friendly ham check the RFI while you are transmitting to ensure that it really is you they are hearing. Try showing them that you have no problems with your TV, scanner etc and suggest they may need to have someone check their coax etc. As 833 suggested DOCUMENT EVERYTHING including having some one confirm you do not cause any RFI to the gear in your own home. |
Crackshot
Intermediate Member
Username: Crackshot
Post Number: 239
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 26, 2006 - 8:02 am: |
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Put a TVI filter on the output of the radio.
If you tried everything that was suggested and running your station in accordance, then it is not your problem, it's your neighbors problem per FCC rules.  |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1558
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, December 26, 2006 - 10:55 am: |
|
Crackshot. Please, that is NOT a 'solution'.
First, even WITH a filter, that does not exclude you from the investigation. Many other factors with your station can be causing the interference, if it is you. The FCC rules say so. Please re-read.
Second, a TVI filter would not cure the type of interference we are discussing here. This interference is closer to 'blanket' interference than harminic interference (which a TVI filter would help).
Let's not confuse the subject with unapplicable 'fixes' or non-existent 'FCC rules' please. However, next time someone posts that their unfiltered radio messes up TV channel 2 on every TV they try, then I expect you to chime in with the first part of your answer quickly! That would be a job well done. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2051
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 12:48 am: |
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Already using a high quality TVI filter and
it has not helped. Have other issues that
need investigated.
Today: So far, i had my wife key up today while i was at one of the neighbors house. Yes, i am
calming over there Bearcat police scanner.
I had my Radio Shack police scanner with me
and i made sure that i programmed every freq
that was in there scanner in my scanner.
My wife keyed up and counted and nothing. Did
not come through it. These neighbors have 3 scanners. I come over 2 of them.
Some things i noticed today, but, not sure if they are important or not.
First, they have a tower with a old moonraker.
2 coaxs come off tower along with rotor cable.
They do not use them anymore, but, have coaxs
and connectors just laying on the floor of
there kitchen. They also have a groundplane
antenna on a pole about 10-15 yards from tower.
Coax on it also laying in kitchen.
They have long drag cords on all there scanners
also. But, even using the long drag, my scanner
showed no sign of my wife coming over it.
They are complaining of me coming over there
TV, phones, police scanners.
I need to do more investigating with there
phones and TV yet.
---------------------------------------------
I took our cordless phone outfit over to other
neighbors house. It's one that has 2 phones to
it and it is a 2.4 GHZ cordless phone.
I mounted base in there kitchen exactly where
theres is. Had my wife talk and count using
the neighbors phone first, she was coming over
it. Hooked up our cordless outfit and heard nothing while wife was transmitting. Even hooked
our cordless outfit base in neighbors bedroom.
Tested neighbors phone first, wife was coming
over it. Hooked up our cordless base and
again, heard nothing coming over our phone.
I have more investigating to do and i'll
keep you all up-to-date... |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2052
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 12:53 am: |
|
By the way, my I-10k and tower are roughly
about 40-60ft from the one neighbors moonraker/tower and groundplane antenna. |
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 2352
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 12:57 am: |
|
dealing with neighbors about RFI issues is a hassle at best, and a war at worst.
nothing is more difficult than trying to explain the whys and hows of this stuff to someone who has no experience with it.
also, it is hard to be diplomatic in saying to them that is is their equipments fault.
i interfere with one neighbor that i know of.
i will come through her clock radio and her cordless phone.
i have put my radio back to stock with regard to AMC limiters and NPC mods.
i dont have a spec. analyzer, but the circuitry in the radio is all intact and acting as it should.
i also run a low pass filter as a just in case.
her house is the same height as mine, and my top one sits atop a 35' mast in the center of my roof.
a total mast height of 50'.
my station is well grounded. (dont have the room to run radials, but would like to) the coax is LMR400.
here is the kicker, she says now that i am not coming through the clock radio anymore, but still am affecting the cordless phone.
apparently it shuts off on her sometimes and will come back on later. she is convinced it is my station causing this because i was honest with her about what was happening with the clock radio.
i can say 100% that it is not me making the phone shut off, as the last time she told me about it, i had not used the radio in over two weeks. it was at my work being aligned.
i simply cannot convince this woman that its not the huge honking antenna on my roof that is causing the problem.LOL
the antenna is an eye sore im sure, and why would the neighbors not think that it is the cause?
my solution is to be a good neighbor and help her if she needs it with whatever chore she is doing.
i also talk alot more SSB than i used to.
as far as advice goes, all i can say is to check the neighbors' grounding system at their house.
maybe they need an extra ground rod pounded in, as the TV, the phone, and whatever the scanner is plugged into all will share the same ground.
it could be acting like a big antenna.
does the interference happen to their scanners when run off of a battery?
good luck with this, i know that its no fun,
matt |
Airplane1
Advanced Member
Username: Airplane1
Post Number: 951
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 7:39 am: |
|
Well I would say that if your electronic devices dont have the problem when you hook them up at there home then I would say it is there electronic devices. If there coax laying in the kitchen was the cause then your electonic devices you hook up at there home would do it too. I think they need to get new devices because your station dont seem to be the problem but there devices do.
My 2 cents,
AP |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2055
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 4:09 pm: |
|
Kid, the battery in your neighbors cordless
phone is probably not holding a good charge
anylonger. Ours did that and we replaced battery and it was fine. |
Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 665
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 5:49 pm: |
|
Calmly suggest that removing the tower and the old unused antennas would be a great first step. Explain, that although you cannot be sure if they are the problem, it is a known fact that antennas that have unterminated coaxes (or ones that are terminated but the radio is turned off) has been known to cause problems with RFI.
A thought,. if they are using a distributed sysme that has multiple coax sockets for the TV do they, of recent times, have any sockets that no long have a TV connected to them? This may, at times, also be a cause of problems. If they they can buy or make a 75ohm terminator to terminate that run. |
Jellybean
Intermediate Member
Username: Jellybean
Post Number: 111
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, December 27, 2006 - 8:15 pm: |
|
I had that problem with my close neighbor and ended up buying them a better phone, $70, but worth it. Did some other things for them, kinda tricky but to me it was worth it. The cheap stuff they had was the problem. I was only at 12w ssb. The satelite problem with them, was the company had come out and re-aligned the thing and it was going right through my antenna, , I showed them that and told them they would have to have that redone. I worked with them on their favorite times to watch tv, though this doesn't sound like your problem since it's happening to different neighbors. Being diplomatic goes a long ways. Once, before I replace their phone, she was doing their auto tags over the phone. After a little wait to get off hold, I keyed up during some info exchanged and cut their phone call off!! They were hunters and she was coming out with a rifle and was going to shoot my antenna! Her husband calmed her down and I investigated and mildly worked with them to solve some problems. It was kinda funny, but it finally got resolved. I had already done everything posible to my station to fix it, and it was just the junk they thought was good stuff, was junk.
I know it's frustrating, but keep plugging along, you'll get there.
Jerry
cef 542 |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2056
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, December 28, 2006 - 12:07 am: |
|
Tech 833, i was re- reading your review on
I-10k antenna, below is a little piece from it.
Along with my neighbors having crappy
electronic devices.
Could the following also cause trouble?
-------------------------------------------
The I-10K has very good gain on the horizon and a very smooth pattern with no unusual minimas or nulls in the H plane. We were surprised to see the amount of radiation directly below the base of the I-10K. This is likely a result of the large amount of horizontal tuning section within the field of the vertical radiator. However, this is not unusual to see in base-fed gain antennas. |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1562
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, December 28, 2006 - 1:41 am: |
|
I would not say it is causing the trouble, I would say that it may make it worse than another antenna in the exact same situation.
In your case, I would say that replacement or repair of the neighbor's electronics may be the only solution.
No ego, no signature line.
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2057
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, December 28, 2006 - 7:55 am: |
|
Yeah, that's what it is looking like Tech 833. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2061
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 7:22 pm: |
|
I cured my one neighbors phone problem
by giving her a good phone i had here.
BUT, the other neighbor has a cluster of
things i see wrong and they are not willing
to work with me.. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2063
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, December 31, 2006 - 7:59 pm: |
|
My one neighbor besides having a tower and
a groundplane that's both ready to fall down.
I went over there today and noticed the
legs on the bottom of there tower are ate
through with rust. They have about 10 real
long metal guy wires holding up tower.
No egg insulators on them. I showed them the
rusted out tower legs and they didn't seem to care at all. It's going to fall someday.
I can't believe it is still standing.
They have grandchildren which they watch and
they play near that tower and the groundplane they have is hanging by one antenna u-bolt
over a electrical wire. Been hanging like
that for almost 2 years now. When that u-bolt
breaks it's coming down on that wire.
They don't seem to care.
I'm going to switch out the I-10k with a
Top One when better weather hits. Set things
up correctly and that's all i can do to help.
They will have to be responsible for there
own stuff, i tried my best.
For now until i get Top One up, i'm running
a Horz dipole in the attic, so, as not to
upset them until i get up Top One. |
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 2357
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 02, 2007 - 6:40 pm: |
|
RW,
it might be a good idea to go ahead and get your ham license.
there's no code and the test is pretty easy if you study online a bit.
that way, if and when the "unneighborly" neighbors try to involve some authoritative body; you will have legal back up for your right to have that tower up.
think of it like really cheap insurance.
you'd be surprised what a difference in meaning the terms "ham operator" and "cb'er" have to a cop or a city/ county official.
best of luck,
matt |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2065
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, February 08, 2007 - 8:08 pm: |
|
Kid, things already blew up... I tried and i
tried to help them and they would not take any of my advice. I was very nice with them.. They called the police on me because of the RFI issues. This all happened today. Along with the local police was a code officer and another gentleman. After they looked things over they said, i'm completely legal and ok. Then, i directed them back over to the neighbors house to check their tower base that is rusted through and an antenna they have hanging sideways over a electric wire. Neighbors got fined and were asked to remove their tower and broken antenna within 30 days on safety violations. So, it hasn't been a fun time here...LOL..Yes, i may take the ham test Kid... Thanks for the suggestion... |
Chad
Senior Member
Username: Chad
Post Number: 1277
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 9:58 am: |
|
Checkmate!
Chad
CEF 433
HAM 212
not an ego thing, just keepin' the mods happy
|
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 2386
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 13, 2007 - 11:50 pm: |
|
jim, im sure that things are a bit tense around the ol neighborhood these days, but i must say, "that si too cool!!!"
oh man would i love to have been there to see the cops go to their door and deliver the news!LOL
the sad thing is; im sure they somehow still blame you, and now consider you to be less than a friend.
one thing i wanted to ask you. i know you have been on the air for a while, and have used many different antennas.
are these new neighbors? or old issues finally coming to a head?
matt |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2067
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, February 16, 2007 - 6:34 am: |
|
Same neighbor, same problems...LOL
Boiling to a giant head and exploding!
I proved to them it was there consumer
products as i hooked a bunch of my stuff up
at there household and we had no problem. They still refused to believe it...
They also refused to believe i was only running 2 watts and i even showed them on my SWR watt meter.
Still didn't believe me...LOL...Neighbors told cops i had a giant Linear amp in my attic hidden under the floor boards. I had to laugh at that one....lol...
The woman has a loud mouth and screams swear-words at me when i'm outside. Day the police showed up i told them to please refrain the woman
from screaming stuff. She ignores me now, so, something must of been said to her.
Guess the days of getting along with that neighbor
is over for now. |
Airplane1
Advanced Member
Username: Airplane1
Post Number: 965
Registered: 5-2004
| | Posted on Friday, February 16, 2007 - 7:45 am: |
|
that is a shame it has to be that way, I think they of all people should have worked with you as you said they had cbs at one time too.
good luck,
Roger |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1605
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Friday, February 16, 2007 - 10:03 am: |
|
Neighbors that ignore you is a WONDERFUL thing. Now, you no longer need to endure the harassment. |
Wildrat
Senior Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 1218
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2007 - 12:21 am: |
|
I feel for ya RW! I have the same problem here with some high rent slum houses. I come over their TV, phone, stereo. They are on an antenna like myself, but I am grounded and my consumer products are modern. I have given out a couple of high pass filters and took care of the TV problem. It;s funny how they get tvi and I don't. I don't even have a high pass on my sets. I am grounded well though. There is one guy who says I get in his cell phone, it's probably Sprint(ha-ha) Oh well, I am always polite and show an interest in the problem and offer advice. The biggest issue with my neighbors are the buildings they live in. The structures are old, have cloth wiring, no grounds, etc. Anyway, sounds like you will be having a battle for quite awhile not unless someone moves or you buy them an inexpensive phone and ground the two bad scanners. Oh well talk at ya later.
WILDRAT
MARK
27.285MHZ
CEF674
CVC029
|
Starface
Senior Member
Username: Starface
Post Number: 1128
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2007 - 10:55 pm: |
|
RESOLVING RFI ISSUES WITH A NEIGHBOR
DO's AND DON'TS
ARRL publishes an RFI pamphlet, written specifically to help explain interference to your neighbors. To get a couple of copies, send an SASE to the ARRL Technical Department Secretary, 225 Main St, Newington, CT 06111, along with a
request for "2 RFI pamphlets." The text of this pamphlet is available on ARRL's Web page, but the actual printed pamphlet is more effective with your neighbor than a downloaded Web page, in most cases.
Don't take immediate responsibility for the problem. Make it clear that although you are the source of an outside radio signal, the neighbor's device is supposed to be designed to reject it.
Do not perform modifications on AC powered equipment that is not your own. Remember -- house AC power is dangerous and you may be blamed if anything EVER goes wrong with the device or house wiring. These modifications must only be performed by qualified service personnel!
Install a low-pass filter on your HF station.
For telephone interference problems, offer to loan the neighbor an RF resistant telephone for testing and have him unplug all other phones.
In regards to problems with close neighbors complaining about your radio interfering with their computers: Tell them to take their problem up with the computer manufacturer. DO NOT, under any circumstances, work on a neighbor's computer even if he is a close friend. The reason for this is that at a later date if and when any problem occurs (especially a data crash) you will be
blamed. FCC rules on computer RFI are simple and clear cut. Computers are part 15 devices and as such they may not interfere with any licensed radio service and must accept any interference
GETTING THE FCC INVOLVED
The FCC no longer investigates RFI complaints to telephone, TV or entertainment systems. You can call their 800 number (888-CALL-FCC) and listen to the FCC's RFI message. It is educational. You might want to give this number to your
complaining neighbor since it tells him it's most likely his equipment at fault-not yours. You can also find out how to order The FCC's interference handbook which tells the same story. Get an extra one for the neighbor if you want to be nice of course.
Rectification and overload are both problems with the design of the affected equipment, and after decades of investigation, the FCC knows this. That's why their policy is such as it is now. The FCC cannot get laws enacted to correct this by forcing manufacturers to properly design stuff so they've backed off and are not doing anything about it themselves. If the neighbor is unwilling to cooperate, the FCC won't even want to talk with them. They are instructed by the FCC to contact the manufacturer who made the defective equipment for a solution. Sort of a "free market" solution.
One bit of advice: It really helps to clean up your TV/Stereo & telephones, so that you can point at your equipment saying "My TV/Stereo/Telephone doesn't get any interference, so it must be your equipment." While solving your own RFI issues you'll learn how to help your neighbors with theirs (should they finally ask for help). When helping a neighbor it's a good idea to have another local ham familiar with RFI act as a liaison or 3rd party who is not interested in the dispute. Contact your local club or the ARRL for the name of the local TS (Tech Specialist) who is willing to help out in this capacity.
STARFA©E
KI4NBE
CEF476
HAM181
CVC014
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2068
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, March 03, 2007 - 9:42 pm: |
|
My neighbors took the antenna hanging over a electric wire down today. Their tower is coming down soon as it is ready to fall anyhow...
They haven't used that junk since the 70's. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2069
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, March 12, 2007 - 6:12 pm: |
|
Well, neighbor kept yelling bad things at me
almost everytime i left the house, so, had to
have police take care of things. Haven't heard a
peep after that.
FCC told her to contact the Manufacturers of her
consumer products for help. Or send for FCC fact sheets for guidance or remove product from
operation or put up with it.
So, she has been highly upset at me.
I haven't really heard any DX in their at all
lately. Must be at bottom of cycle.
Hope everyone is doing better than i am...LOL
RoadWarrior/ CEF 375/ PA |
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 663
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 9:21 pm: |
|
well sounds like ya should be doing fine now
my neighbor used to complain aswell he must
have called the fcc and they told him pretty much to put up with it.cause he no longer bothers me...thank-you god.what made me upset
is thru the week my radio time is limited due
to work,family,life,ect so most of my radio time
is saturday nite and sunday for the net. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2074
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 9:16 pm: |
|
Things have got very ugly here. I'm not dealing with a rational neighbor, but, crazy people.
They have called the police on me many times.
Since they couldn't win the interference issue
they turn me in for shining flashlights in there windows, running up and down there property at night yelling, blowing there TVs up with my cb
radio, throwing nails under there cars. The police have caught onto there little game and have
warned them from making up fake charges.
If i had the money to move right now, i'd be gone in a flash from this neighborhood.
If i do move sometime, i won't have close neighbors.....LOL |
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 774
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 9:49 pm: |
|
i feel for ya .when i first moved were im at now
i had somewhat sililar problems but without the childish games of calling police.i be on radio
and they yell out thier back door.then when i kept talking i heard pound pound pound on my door and of coursre it was my neighbor.and well
things almost got to the point were it got phyiscal.then he said hes gomnna call the fcc on
me i told him go ahead ill give ya the number.
but i know a little bit about what ya going thru
dale/a.k.a.hotrod
cef426
cvc#64
|
Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 746
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 17, 2007 - 9:35 am: |
|
I have also been there, but would not reccomend doing what I did at that time.
I had a neighjbour who wanted to watch TV stations from over 100 miles away - way outside the stations supported region. They complained to Dept of Communications (Australia's FCC at that time) and despite being told I was a licenced ham using legitmate frequencies and that THEY were trying to watch stations not officially received in the area.
One night it came to a head, as I was baout to close down, as I knew they had a show they MUST watch on one of the DX TV Stations the man of the house started commenting about the lousey interference from the !@#$%^& next door. Well out the window went my good intentions and I transmitted a monolog that lasted the full half -hour of the program - thank God for tubed radios.
Funny thing the people put their house on the market about two days later. New people moved in and never any more trouble. If the new people had a show that they wanted to watch on the involved channel they let me know and I'd stay off air - about once or twice a week.
The tv station involved ran form 137MHZ to 144MHz and I was running on 144.4MHZ SSB.
Not advised to try this but I thought it would make a funny annecdote on the topic.
Simon
Tech237
KD7IEB
|
Crackshot
Intermediate Member
Username: Crackshot
Post Number: 299
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 17, 2007 - 12:44 pm: |
|
I was only kidding about the "its thier problem" crack.
Hope you get the RFI troubles resolved.
KE7JFA
CEF 655
HAM 225
ARRL Member
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2080
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 10:08 am: |
|
LOL... Tech237 I'm not even using any power or my bigger antennas for awhile now. Been using a horz 1/2 wave dipole in attic. Even had the ends towards there house and they still complain. Now using a smaller mobile antenna in attic. Still complaining. They are 40-50ft from these antennas.
I strung the Horz dipole across both my living rooms to prove a point. My Tv, computer, scanner, ect. were within 8-10ft of dipole. I could still not come over anything in my house. Also hooked a mobile antenna up in my living rooms, nothing, could not come over anything here at all.
Summer time project will be to move my tower to a new location as far away from them as i can.
CRACKSHOT- no problem...LOL
Actually, after i move tower i have done all i can do on my end to correct problem. It will be there problem after that. Because it's simply there consumer junk that is the problem.
They still haven't taken there old tower down yet either. They have about 12 or more sets of metal guy lines with no eggs to break them up. They still have there horz and vertical coax lines laying in there kitchen. After this stuff comes down, things may improve some, i hope.
There yard is like a radiating mine field...lol
Anyhow, i'll continue running the mobile antenna in the attic with 2 watts coming out of radio until i get tower moved. Yes, there still complaining of me coming over there scanner with 2 watts and a small mobile antenna. |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1662
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 10:33 am: |
|
If they are still complaining, even with the small antenna, you might as well go ahead and run a big antenna as before.
When I was about 14 years old, I was talking to some friends on the radio one night on 10m SSB. Just using the radio, no amp and a 3 element beam at 30 feet AGL. I was home alone (parents out) so all the lights were out except by bedroom. The neighbor called on the phone, I answered. He was screaming into the phone so loud it was distorting as he called me several names and combinations of 4-letter words. I said "Who is this?". That really set him off! HE slammed the phone down, I went back to my QSO. About 30 minutes later, I saw flashlights outside, then a knock at the door. It was the Sheriff. I opened the door, and 3 cops asked if my parents were home. I told them I was home alone. The asked if I was operating a CB radio. I informed them I was operating a ham radio and invited them in to see. They declined, and thanked me for my trouble. A few minutes later, I heard the neighbor screaming at them outside! They were telling him "At least he's not out on the street causing trouble, leave him alone", etc. It was hilarious! Anyway, the neighbor started making trouble for my folks, they had to file a restraining order. That was the very last time I ever heard from him. He was found in his back yard dead some time later. The house sat empty for many years, so I never had any more trouble after that.
Except for the death part, you might want to check out what happened to me. Maybe a restraining order might help the harassment? |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2083
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 4:07 pm: |
|
The small mobile antenna is just going over their
scanner, the bigger antenna is going over their scanner,TV,phones, ect.
No antenna i ever had up came over anything here.
Have other neighbors and they have had no problems either with any of the antennas i had up.
On the other side of me, i was coming over her phone. Gave her a new phone i had here and i haven't heard a peep from her since.
I do have sort of a restrain involved, police told her and family not to speak to me at all.
She calls my wifes cell phone or catches my wife outside to complain. My wifes trying to stay out of it, but, looks like we will have to restrain
neighbor from bothering her also. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2084
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 4:55 pm: |
|
Tech 833- Some antennas the feedline seems to want to radiate. I think you said awhile back that wasn't a major issue for antennas. Does the Top One have the same problem with the feedline
radiating??? (coax)
Just curious and trying to understand antennas more. Thanks... |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2085
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 6:06 pm: |
|
Tech833- one more question has come to my mind.
Most of us just tape coax to tower on the way
down. Would it be better to use standoffs to keep
coax from touching tower?
Or doesn't it matter?
Thanks
RoadWarrior
CEF375 PA |
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 779
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 8:47 pm: |
|
goiod question r.w. i used to use tape but now i use those little plastic zip ties.how old is yor coax.did ya try resoldering all your pl-259 connections
dale/a.k.a.hotrod
cef426
cvc#64
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2086
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 9:24 pm: |
|
All ends were resoldered, didn't make any difference Dale.
The reason i asked the standoff question above
was because, is the coax suppose to touch the tower or would it be better away from tower a bit
using standoffs??? I don't know...lol |
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 2500
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2007 - 12:42 am: |
|
so sad to hear about your woes RW.
i think you have been too nice, and its time to just forget about them and talk on your radio.
as for the top one feedline radiation, im sure 833 can say it better, but i asked him if i needed a choke balun with my top one, and he said that because of the unique design of the antenna that one is not needed.
something to do with the way its fed.
im willing to bet that if an electrician went to your neighbors house, he would find big time grounding issues, like their ground wire is not hooked to anything at the main box, or it has corroded away, or, they replaced their water heater and forgot to hook the ground wire back up to the cold water pipe.
i tell you what, im not one for messing with people's lives, but if you started calling the city and/or county and complaining about the state of their house, yard, etc.; that there would be some code violations and they would have to get this stuff fixed.
good luck to ya!
matt
anyone wanting a "clean signal", just look to the left and build one of these!!!
|
Jameslarson
Intermediate Member
Username: Jameslarson
Post Number: 337
Registered: 4-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2007 - 8:59 pm: |
|
Well, here's my advice. Go to their house real neighborly like, and Make them an offer they can't refuse. Always works out here in NY at least. ;-) |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1664
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 11:03 am: |
|
The Top One will not suffer from feedline radiation as much as other antennas.
Bonding the coax to the tower at increments is highly suggested. Taping or zip-tying the coax to the tower is better than using standoffs. Make darn sure you ground the coax shield at the base of the tower! Once you do this, there should be NO RF coming into your home from the coax shield. If there is, your ground is inadequate. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2087
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 11:43 am: |
|
I have all that done Tech833. I have no problems here at all. I read an article that said to use standoffs, so, i figured i'd ask you for the real
scoop. My coax is taped and tie wrapped. And coax shield is grounded at base of tower. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2089
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 11:15 am: |
|
My friend has a police scanner that is easy to go over while transmitting, so, i borrowed it to experiment. I placed the scanner a few feet from my mobile antenna i'm using in the attic.
Had my uncle transmit and behold his voice came screaming through the scanner.
This scanner has a 6ft plug-in-type ac cord that is quite thin. I wrapped the ac cord up in a scheme, back and forth with the wire, then i taped it. The wire was only about 9-10 inches when i was done wrapping. Just barely long enough to reach ac outlet. Well, interference to the scanner was reduced drasticly! I actually had to put my ear to the speaker to even hear a hint of my uncle as he was transmitting.
Then, i figured,this kind of stinks as not much ac cord was left. So, i decided to wrap the ac cord up entirely in a scheme. Then, i added a 6ft ac dragcord. To my surprise the interference was still reduced to almost nothing. That part i do not understand. So, i tell my cranky neighbor of my findings, she tells me to F*#* off that it's not her scanner. So, you just can't deal with them at all.
KID----I thought the Top One was like you stated above, but, i wasn't sure.
Anyhow, my friend took the scanner back and hes enjoying not coming over it now and i learned something. |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1668
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 2:20 pm: |
|
Standoffs are for balanced feedline or insulated feedline only.
Your A/C cord results are a form of 'detuning'. You can als make a choke out of the power cord or use ferrite chokes (make sure to use material rated at the frequency of interest!) to do the same thing. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2090
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, April 20, 2007 - 4:35 pm: |
|
Ok Tech 833 on the standoffs...Thanks
I wish my neighbor would at least try using chokes or choking the ac line of their scanner.
But, they won't listen to me to even try it. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2099
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 1:53 pm: |
|
Now, neighbor is trying to sue me for blowing up her Tv with my mobile antenna in attic and my mighty 2 watts output from radio....LOL
I contacted our local FCC office for advice on how to deal with these clowns. Told me if i'm running legal not to worry about it.
I've decided to study and take the test for a Ham License also. Taking your advice Kid....
Road_warrior
CEF 375 PA |
Bruce
Senior Member
Username: Bruce
Post Number: 4431
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 7:31 pm: |
|
Road Warrior
Contact the maker of the Tv and see if they have even a single case of a TV damaged by a radio transmitter ....
On 6 since 66
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2106
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 9:37 pm: |
|
Ok, Bruce... |
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 825
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 9:59 pm: |
|
rw dumb question is your radio clean ?limiter installed.gotta ask cause this is the main reason ive found for tvi issues.poiwer mikes cranked wide open ive found to be the second
biggest cause of tvi.congrats on decideing on getting ticket.however if thier tv doesnt have good filtering which is what i think then i think even a ham radio would do same thing.even though the ham radio would have better filtering.
i think thier tv would still do it.then as a ham
if ya cause tvi and they report ya the fcc WILL
insect your station and DEMAND you tou to quit
talking until your problem is resolved.if it
were me id still take the test but maybe only use a ht cause if ya would cause tvi even with a ham ht you could just walk down the street away from thier house
dale/a.k.a.hotrod
cef426
cvc#64
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2107
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 12:56 am: |
|
By the way Bruce, neighbor said my radio put letters and numbers at the bottom of her tv screen, then it quit. She bought a used TV and it did the same thing. Far as i know it's impossible for a radio signal to produce letters and numbers on a TV. I think shes going insane or something... |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2108
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 02, 2007 - 11:39 pm: |
|
Running stock mic, radio has been aligned and mod limiter is intact in radio. Have 2 Ice TVI filters installed. One directly out of radio and another directly outside at the groundrod. Running 2 watts. 40 inch mobile antenna in attic.
Neighbor is roughly 40ft- 50 ft away from radio and antenna.
Actually the FCC does not invest TVI/RFI interference any longer. They tell the person thats recieving the interference to call the manufacturer of their products for filter information. Already been through that.
I called toll free number and got a recording and called our local FCC office in State College.
Call this toll free number and listen to the FCC RFI message their Dale...
1-800-225-5322 |
Unit199
Intermediate Member
Username: Unit199
Post Number: 465
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 8:20 am: |
|
RW, I WOULD NOT WORRY ABOUT IT. YOU HAVE DONE EVERYTHING YOU COULD, SO I FIGURE IT IS THEIR PROBLEM AND I WOULD GO AHEAD AND TALK ON MY RADIO. I JUST DO NOT THINK YOU CAN SATISFY THEM NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU TRY.
HARVE
UNIT199
CEF210
CVC18
KB0YVK
|
Bruce
Senior Member
Username: Bruce
Post Number: 4432
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 10:06 am: |
|
Has she had her PROZAC today? It puts numbers on things before they blank out .....
On 6 since 66
|
Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 763
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 4:43 pm: |
|
Dale,
You are actually incorrect. Yes teh FCC may request to inspect your station BUT they are much more likely to support you (barring illegal equipemtn etc) than the will a plain CB.
Unfair? yes, but that is the facts of RF life.
Simon
Tech237
KD7IEB
|
Dale
Advanced Member
Username: Dale
Post Number: 830
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 8:52 pm: |
|
tech237 you meaning they support you as a ham
was i reading that right.cause on the license practice test on qrz.com question is.if your station is causing harmful interference what should you do?
answer
fcc will send ya a letter saying about they come out to inspect your station.then your suppose to remedy that problem.and cease all transmissions
until fixed.
this was on qrz.com i know i missed this question 3 times now
dale/a.k.a.hotrod
cef426
cvc#64
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2109
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, May 03, 2007 - 10:35 pm: |
|
In my case the neighbor has crappy consumer products. I already took the mobile antenna out of attic and sit it on a piece of metal in my living room, got SWRs low and talked on it for about half a day. It was roughly 7-8ft from my TV, computer, scanner ect. No interference to any of my own equipment here. Also strung a horz center fed dipole across the living rooms. Wife laughed and said, what the heck are you doing. Told her it was a guy thing...lol... Yet 40ft-50ft over at neighbors there complaining.
I mounted a top one in yard, it was way up at end of yard, above ground 15 ft to ring. Was 15ft from one neighbor, (no interference to him), 50ft from me, (no interference to me), 50ft-60ft from complaining neighbor, (complained...lol).
Far as i'm concerned, her scanner needs the ac line choked or ferrite chokes on ac line. And her phone needs relocated in the house or ferrite chokes, phone filter, maybe a ac line filter on it. But, when i suggest things, they tell me to blank off! So, far as i'm concerned, i've done all i can do. |
Tech237
Moderator
Username: Tech237
Post Number: 765
Registered: 4-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 8:59 am: |
|
Thanks Bruce - I was about to repeat the same thing that I had stated in my post - as long as you station is legal the FCC will support you. If not - well expect the full weight to fall.
Simon
Tech237
KD7IEB
|
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 2112
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, May 04, 2007 - 10:30 am: |
|
I've only been running 2 watts with very little swing Bruce, so, i'm below legal...lol
Yep, right on with your article above Bruce... |
Wildrat
Senior Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 1285
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 10, 2007 - 12:28 pm: |
|
Well,
I read this again, called the 888-call-FCC and listened to their recording and it says they do not routinely investigate interference complaints, it does not say they do not investigate.
I stayed on the line and got William at the FCC and he said the handbook that they are offering is for the consumer to help them figure out what type of interference they are getting along with the info in the recording.
His suggestion was to print out the sections in the rules that apply and give it to them.
WILDRAT
Mark
27.285MHZ
CEF674
CVC029
|
