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Message |
    
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 677
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 10:59 am: | 
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Made a discovery today. One hand on amp power supply and the other hand holding the steel mic cable gave a nice electical buzz. Removed surge protecto from power supply and the volts traveling on the outside declined a bit to about .5 volts using a voltmeter. Why is this occurring?
Needless to say I ran a ground wire outside to a ground rod and grounded the power supply. All is normal now. Soon to get a bus bar to ground each piece. What causes this? Also what could be the benefits I get when I ground my eqiupment like this? thanks |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 231
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 5:07 pm: |
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Grounding is what causes it! i.e. The lack there of.
P.S. When my son ever gets time to help me set my station back up the one thing that will take the most time will be setting up the grounding system. Grounding is critical, not just for lightning protection which is a part of it but for the equipment to function properly, the antenna being a part of the equipment.
When I recently put my S9 in my jeep along with my new Astatic 636L mic I was getting some very good RF burns from my lips touching the mic grill, and my hand on the mic cord, and also when touching the freq. selector knob.
The cause of it was grounding. I mounted my antenna to the rear tire carrier and I had run grounds thru the hinges to the main chassis of the jeep, well opening and closing the tailgate caused the ground to fail. So the result was painful. I put better and more grounds on the door for the antenna, and also went ahead and put another ground on my overhead equipment rack. So I guess what I am saying is togive more attention to your grounding than you do the rest of the install. There are threads on the forum about grounding. Find Lon's/Tech808 thread on what he did and look at his pictures, you will see what I mean about grounding.
Wildrat
CEF674 |
Moonraker
Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 58
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, November 06, 2005 - 6:36 pm: |
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Hotwire, did you get a shock with the radio keyed or unkeyed? If it was not transmitting and you got an electrical shock form the case of your power supply, this could be faulty wiring in your house or there could be something wrong with your power supply. If you are getting a shock (RF burn) only when the radio is transmitting, you have a grounding problem. |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 684
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Monday, November 07, 2005 - 11:58 am: |
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Moonraker its both. The shock was intense when using a microwave surge protector. Remove the surge protector and was just barely a little current flowing. Enough to make a static noise when connecing the ground wire to the supply. The ground prong may not be grounding the supply to the house so I'm going to check for proper wiring. BTW the ground wire to the ground rod out side has solved my problem. |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 685
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Monday, November 07, 2005 - 12:01 pm: |
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Oh one more thing. Moonraker the shock did not come from the power supply case it camme from the radio with my other hand on the supply. The radio is on its own supply. The big power supply in question powers my linear. |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 233
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Monday, November 07, 2005 - 12:53 pm: |
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You have grounding issues! Resolve them and you won't have a problem. |
Moonraker
Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 64
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Monday, November 07, 2005 - 9:10 pm: |
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I think your power supply is grounded fine. Electricity takes the path of least resistance to ground. When you are grounded to your power supply you feel the shock. As wildrat said, you do have grounding issues, but the ground is there to give the electricity a better path to ground instead of going through you! I still think there is another problem because the case of the radio should not be electrified no matter if it is grounded or not. If you were getting a shock only while transmitting, I would say it is all grounding. It is a good idea to ground your radio, the problem will most likely go away, but I think you are just covering up the problem. I'm not saying not to ground your radio, It is a very good idea th have all your equipment grounded. |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 689
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 08, 2005 - 11:19 am: |
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OK problem found. Those adapters that are made for a 2 prong outlet so a 3 prong can go in. Don't ask what it was doing there cause I dont know. Anyway the problem is gone now, so now I have a project at hand. Since now I have a fat ground wire through the wall from outside I'm gonna ground all my gear.
SINKER! Hey if you read this thanks for the pics you posted. Your good work on grounding has given me some ideas on what I need to do! I really think Sinker did a great job.
I went out and bought a copper pipe to drill holes in for my buss bar. Stripped all the insulation off some rg8 coax and now I have some nice copper braid for grounding. Did'nt think it would work but if you take your time with a razor and carefully pull out the center cunductor the braid will go flat and is really nice looking. Amazing but the braid is like 90% of what makes up the coax.Gonna take my time and solder on ends and all the goodies. Hopefully when I'm done it will look good and be hard to detect. Thanks guys for the help. The members here make Copper #1. 73 |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 696
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, November 19, 2005 - 11:06 am: |
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I have everything grounded big time now. Each piece of gear every thing in the room. I STILL GET SHOCKED!!!!! Now if I walk across the room maybe dragging my feet and reach for the radio I get a ZAPP. Anyone know how to ground the cber? I know its called static electricity but this is getting very annoying!!!! |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 335
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, November 19, 2005 - 2:14 pm: |
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not much you can do about static electricity. Change to a different type shoe, wear cotton socks instead of the polyester type is you walk around without shoes on and just socks. Put down some of that plastic/rubber stuff used to protect carpets. That static charge you build up is enough to take out a computer or similar device. When I do computer work I usually have my home made static discharge wire connected to me then ground. Sometimes I'll build up a good charge then go kiss my wife. She doesn't like that much. You might be able to maybe spray the area with scotch guard. It might help. Oh Well just don't discharge into any of your electronics.
Wildrat |
Road_warrior
Advanced Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 947
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, November 19, 2005 - 8:47 pm: |
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I read and hear about people getting mic
bite and things that go along with grounding issues. But, have never personally experienced it myself yet, even while using ungrounded equipment.
Haven't even been shocked by static electricty
for a long while. Maybe i'm immune to it...LOL
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Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 338
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, November 19, 2005 - 9:10 pm: |
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If you ever get that RF Burn you will remember it especially if it gets you in it's grip long enough.
Wildrat
CEF674 |
Road_warrior
Advanced Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 952
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:39 am: |
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Only thing i can remember doing was i accidently
grabbed hold of a wire that was plugged into
the house outlet.
Was using my uncles old Tram radio years ago
and he didn't have the proper AC plug on it.
Homemade jobby until he found one.
Lit me up like a Christmas tree...LOL |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 345
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:17 am: |
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Before I got out of the military and came back to Florida, I was in a southern state of disarray north of Florida. There was this Tom Cat that always walked on my T-Bird at night and marking it's territory. One night I came back from Tech School.It was about 11 pm. I was sitting in the car talking to the guys on the radio. Then I heard something, the cat had jumped up on the car, it did not know I was there. It proceeded to my antenna, a Wilson 1000 trunk mount and stsrted using it for a scratching post. I said to myself let me see if I can teach this cat something about radio. I turned my old Texas Star DX 500 up to high and said hello to the cat. I must have scared the cat when I said hello because it screamed and jumped up in the air about three feet and ran off. I never saw the cat again and he did not mark his territory onmy T-Bird anymore. Thats a RF shock. I don't care for cats much.
Wildrat
CEF674
You would think a rat would like cats.
Oh an RF bite is nothing like the tingle from a power outlet. |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 700
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 11:26 am: |
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I don't think cats and rats are to fond of each other there Wildrat. I have heard of massive rats capable of whipping some cat rear end. Your avatar rat is freaking me out! |
Allagator
Advanced Member
Username: Allagator
Post Number: 720
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 6:17 pm: |
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OH MY !!! JUST ASK LON ABOUT A RF BITE FROM A KLV1000 !!!!!! LOL
Sorry Lon i had to bring it up again ! LOL |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 363
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 9:37 am: |
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My ray sits behind me near the radio to guard it. He has friends also that help him when he's eating. When I get my corner set back up, I'll post a picture of the rat family.
Wildrat
What about this bite Lon? |
Road_warrior
Advanced Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 967
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 2:03 pm: |
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From the sounds of it, i'm glad i have not
experienced a mic bite yet...
JIM/PA/CEF375 |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 366
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 6:52 pm: |
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Just remember to unkey the mic when it starts hurting.
Wildrat
P.S. My previous post was suppose to say that My RAT sits behind me..... |
Moonraker
Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 85
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 8:09 pm: |
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You can't just give up and unkey the mic. "NO PAIN NO GAIN" |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1107
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 24, 2005 - 3:48 pm: |
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The U.S. Marines taught me that "Pain is just weakness leaving the body". |
Wildrat
Intermediate Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 371
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, November 24, 2005 - 6:40 pm: |
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U.S.Air Force taught me that you can tell a Marine anything and they'll beleive it. Kinda like when I was in Norway and a couple Marines asked me what I did and I told them I was a cruise missile pilot. They were in awe that I was a pilot. I told them to stop by we might be able to give them a ride. I don't think it was just weakness that was leaving! |
Bruce
Senior Member
Username: Bruce
Post Number: 3255
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Friday, November 25, 2005 - 11:06 am: |
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Army tought me be smarter than the airforce or marines ....... |
