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Message |
    
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 1
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 6:22 pm: | 
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I plan on getting a KL-300P soon. My AM dead-key will be 300 watts. I'm curious as to how much forward swing i'm going to have on AM with 4 watts input & most importantly how much swing on side band. Does anyone know ????? Any info. would be greatly appreciated. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 1827
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 6:42 pm: |
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Hellcat610,
I would suggest No More than 2 to 2 1/2 watts drive and it will last forever.
Also PLEASE READ, The GREAT REVIEW that Steve Tech181 wrote on the KL300P MOBILE AMPLIFIER.
He spent many hour's of his Free Time to do this Review for the Copper Forum Member's.
It should answer all of the Question's you may have on this Amplifier and it's Performance.
Please Go to the:
Subscriber (Preview) Area here on the Forum.
Then Click on: Product Reviews
Then Click on: KL300P Mobile Amplifier
Start reading and enjoy.
Lon
Tech808
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Highlander
Intermediate Member
Username: Highlander
Post Number: 456
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 7:07 pm: |
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Hellcat610, 808 is right on-no more than 2.5 watts deadkey from your radio, or whatever gives you about 60 watts deadkey OUT of the amp. You do NOT want to run it with 300 deadkey out of the amp, you will smoke it if you do that. |
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 2
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 7:26 pm: |
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I was under the assumption that it was ok to use a 4-watt drive. I can do 1-2 watts though. My radio will support that just fine. I was also under the assumption that the KL-300 delivered 300 watts since the site listing notes it that way. My main question is how many watts would I swing on sideband with a 150 watt dead-key if I can't do 300 ?? If the site lists it to deliver 300 watts why does the tech note that the output is 180 watts with 13.8v DC ?? Just a bit confused |
Highlander
Intermediate Member
Username: Highlander
Post Number: 457
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 8:18 pm: |
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I don't know why KLV tells people that 4 watts deadkey is ok, it might work for a while, but not for long. ALL amp makers use model numbers that are misleading. You might get 300 watts pep out of it if you drove it hard enough, but it wouldn't last very long.
You seem to be confused about the difference between AM and SSB. AM has a carrier that is present when you key the radio. When you speak into the microphone, you are modulating that carrier, which is what produces the audio in your signal. If you modulate your carrier to 100 percent, the output with modulation will be 4 times your carrier power (but most CB meters will read closer to 3 times carrier power). For your situation, if you set your radio to a carrier of 2 watts, you will most likely see a 60 to 80 watt carrier out of the amp with no modulation. Then when you speak (modulate), your power will "swing" upwards to around 180 watts, give or take.
SSB does not transmit a carrier, you should only see power readings on your meter when you speak into the mic. How much power your amp will put out in this mode is a function of how much your radio puts in. Just a guess here, but if your radio puts out 20 watts peak power on sideband, you might see around 180 to 200 watts out of the amp. You must have a meter than can read peak power to see this. But don't sweat power readings too much-it will drive you nuts. If you get anything close to these numbers, your amp is working fine.
There are others here that can probably explain this better, but that is in my experience what you should be looking for. |
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 3
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 9:31 am: |
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I appreciate the info. Highlander. Misleading would be exactly right. I understand the difference between AM & SSB. Maybe should've worded it a little differently. What gets me is why would they advertise the amp to produce 300 watts when it only peaks at 200-225 watts max. I was looking for something a little more than 200. I've been trying to find the best way to improve local communication between myself & another mobile operator around 20-25 miles apart and also for SSB DX communications for myself. Currently I'm running a Galaxy DX 949 radio with a Wilson "little wil" mag. mount antenna. I have a 102" I'm thinking of upgrading too that may be better without having to push too much power because I don't want to push any more than I really need if I can help it. Any ideas ?? |
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 4
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 9:37 am: |
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Also the other operator I'm talking to has a very similar mobile setup with a slightly better antenna. Both our SWR reading are very good & the terrain between us has no mountains or deep valleys...fairly flat to say the least. Just trees, hills & a few towns in between which I know makes a considerable difference. I just wonder if mounting my 102" to my truck would help much since I can't increase the height of either station. |
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 5
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 10:22 am: |
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I know that even with the 102" I'm still going to need some kind of power but i'm wondering how much less power I would need using the 102 rather than the wilson antenna. |
Highlander
Intermediate Member
Username: Highlander
Post Number: 459
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 3:02 pm: |
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The 102 whip would most likely be a noticable improvement. The little wil really isn't much of an antenna compared to it's bigger brothers, the 1000 and the 5000. I would recommend the wilson 1000 or the 102 whip.
Getting a bigger amp won't do much more for you than the 300p unless you get something that does ALOT more power, because of the logarithmic relationship between power and range. I forget what the exact rule is, but I think you need 4 times the power to double your range. So that first big jump from 4 watts to 180 is what makes the biggest difference, from there it gets kind of futile. Doubling your power usually only gets you 1/2 an S-unit on the received end. Your best bet is to upgrade your antenna and run sideband to be able to reach your freind consistantly. Also, I would recommend the KLV-400 mobile amp instead of the 300p, because it is biased class AB1, while the 300p is biased class C. Class C is not the best choice for single sideband, class AB1 is much more appropriate for SSB use(and still works great on AM). Talk about misleading model numbers, though, the 400 is still just a 2-pill like the 300p, and it's output will be very similar to the 300p(nowhere near 400 watts, OMG!). But I have one in my mobile and it works really well with my wilson 1000, President Lincoln, and Astatic 575 hand mic. I can talk to just about anyone I can hear, and get lots of compliments on the clarity and strengh of my signal. |
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 7
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 4:24 pm: |
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Thanks again for the input highlander. I may give the KL 400 a try. I looked at RN's(the manufacturer's) website & they described the 300p to deliver a full 300 watts when used with SSB & 150 watts max on AM. I guess with 3 different stories I'm hearing now maybe I'll know for sure when I get a watt meter that will handle the load. My friend & I plan to test his out a little as far as transmit range tonight. He currently has the 300p. It sounds really good a few miles away but haven't had a chance to make any real contacts with it yet. I tried a few nights ago to hear him on AM approx. 25 miles away in a completely flat & rural area & couldn't hear him at all with him running it on high. There was hardly any white noise present at the time. I was disappointed with that but I want to check his SWR again & try it from a couple of different locations & see what happens in ssb mode. Since I got my new radio yesterday we'll be able to try it on sideband & see if that works out any better. Good to hear the Wilson 1000 is working for you. I've been debating on getting that or either the 102 but not sure how I would like dodging drive-thru's & such. Guess we'll see in a few weeks. |
Highlander
Intermediate Member
Username: Highlander
Post Number: 462
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 7:32 pm: |
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What kind of radio did you get? |
Bullet
Intermediate Member
Username: Bullet
Post Number: 291
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 7:55 pm: |
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wow 4 watts, i wouldnt want a mobile amp that wouldnt handle a 4 watts dead key from dust till dawn.
tells me it aint rugged enuff!
just my 2 cents |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 1765
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 8:29 pm: |
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The kl500 WILL put out 400 though if you want that much,and so will the boomer400. |
Hellcat610
New member
Username: Hellcat610
Post Number: 9
Registered: 3-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 9:58 pm: |
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The radio I got is the Galaxy DX 949. And yes 400 watts would be plenty. I won't need that much all the time though but it would be nice to have when I need it. Just looking for a good amp to use with the 949 & a Wilson 1000. I want to be able to talk back to another mobile operator I know that's 20 or 25 miles away locally on AM in relatively flat terrain & want to be able to do my DXing on SSB without having to park atop a mountain somewhere to do it. |
