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707
| | Posted on Saturday, August 24, 2002 - 10:04 pm: | 
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It used to be that amateur radio was an opportunity to learn a little about electronics, or a lot, but the point being, you kind of gained an understanding of "how things work". No more. Appliance Operators....that's what today's crop of so-called "tech" licensees are..
I've had a Ten-Tec 6m transverter up on Ebay for a few days, and just received the 9th email asking "Will it take more than 5w input? I want to use it on a (insert radio name here). My answer is "no, it is set for 5-8w, however it can easily be modified by changing the resistor pad on the input. This is detailed in the Instruction/Construction manual included and takes a few minutes to do". Of the 9 I replied to, 6 have replied that "Oh..well, I don't want to have to change it" or "I wouldn't know how to do that" or something to that effect.
Folks..it is ONE resistor. 5 minutes with a screwdriver and a soldering iron. Sheesh.... |
bruce
| | Posted on Saturday, August 24, 2002 - 10:27 pm: |
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707 im with you on this one it amazing how little schools teach and how little some of the hams i know realy know. We have a opening for a radio tech here at the jail and 20 people applyed 4 passed the basic test 3 could not get past the basic backgroubd check the last standing was a 65 year old retired engeener who was hired we still have one spot open and no takers sad |
BIG FOOT
| | Posted on Saturday, August 24, 2002 - 10:28 pm: |
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..PLEASE go easy on them... once it is done a time or two, it is NOT big deal, once you get burned by a hot soldering iron ( and survive)..you are bound and determined NOT to get BURNED again by that (fine-outstanding) soldering iron !!...kit mnaking is FUN.. the hard part is getting started.. it is worth it when you turn it ON and it actually works, but most folks are TIMID to try it the first time...BIG FOOT |
DeadlEyes
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 10:16 am: |
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Re 7
The "Tech" license is more like the old time 'Novice' Class license. The only thing they know about electronics, and not much at that, is OHMs Law.
You do not get into the technical/electronics heavily untill the Extra Class test.
Hams have been appliance ops ever since I got my very first Novice License in the early 70s. We did a little home brew stuff with Heath Kits but that was about all. Even back then most people send their radios back to the factories for repairs.
So it is not a new thing this Appliance Op status. Heck I could not repair my own radio. Today they use micro circits, surface mount technology, computer chips, etc. My short, puggy fingers were never designed to work in that kind of circut board environment.
:-O :-) |
707
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 11:42 am: |
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Well, it's not a kit anymore because it's already built. The modification is about as difficult as soldering two wires together. I guess these new "Techs" will be traveling to the local CB or Ham shop the next time they need a mic wired or a coax connector put on. Sad. I compare this to a guy not knowing how to add oil to a lawnmower and calling in a lawnmower repairman to do it. |
Alsworld
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 2:31 pm: |
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wow,
I can see where this post will really attract people to get their ham license (spoken as sarcastically as possible). Such motivating words from senior hams...NOT! 707, it's your words that are sad. You generalized every licensed Technician by the less than 10 responses you got. Were you immediately an expert when you first started?
It used to be called Novice, the initial step into Amateur radio, then someone changed the rules. Now "Technician" is the intial step. That is not the fault of any inspiring Technician want-to-be's. We don't name the classes of licenses. For many, this is their first introduction to learn even basic electronics.
If you don't like it, why don't you do something useful like mentor, Elmer, encourage, teach, inspire, rather than put down those who just might be interested in Amateur radio, or want to know more.
You should be ashamed of your post if you believe in the future of amateur radio.
There must be over 200 years worth of radio experience in the above post but why don't you do something positive instead of belittle people by the stroke of your keyboard.
You guys are better than that.
Alsworld |
BIG FOOT
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 3:18 pm: |
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...707... it is a big thrill to BUILD a kit, whether it be just a simple am broadcast receiver, or something harder to do....nuthin like the feeling you get from accidently burning your fingers on the solder/gun and mentally telling yourself it will not happen again/I will be more careful ... the THRILL in it is when it actually WORKS ( YOU did it, not some one at an assembly line )...and the time it took to BUILD it from scratch was not that much, in reality, PLUS look at the EXPERIENCE you got!!....kits are FUN and challenging, any one can be an "appliance operator ", but kits are FUN !!....PRAISE the LORD...BIG FOOT |
Buck
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 7:57 pm: |
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I agree with Alsworld wholeheartedly. I am currently studying to get my ticket(I could pass the written but Im still working on my code), but 707 has really discouraged me and Im sure alot of others. If I bought a new radio I would be A little gunshy about tearing into it and clipping or changing things. Ive been in CB radio for all of 15 years and I can do simple repairs ( solder coax ends, wire a mic,ect.) Ive never worked on any radios really but Im still learning and will continue to learn until I hang up my mic. But even when I pass my exam and get my "TECH" ticket, I will consider myself a Novice because I WONT BE A TECH. Im not sure how 707 started out but Im pretty sure that you were not Einstein. You learned just like the rest of us. Now that you think you know all there is to know you look down on everyone that is not your caliber..Exactly the kind of ham I will not be |
Kb5lpa
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 8:18 pm: |
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There have been several name changes to ham licenses over the last 80 years. Check out the license restructuring of 2000.
Novice licenses were the entry level for quite a few years. The Tech was added and the General test was broken into element 3a and 3b. The Advanced appeared then disappeared and the Extra originally had no extra privileges except that you could get a 2x1 call and that you had done 20 wpm cw. With all that said....the Tech is the way to get into amateur radio. Whether a person knows electronics or not, that is the entry level. The one thing it does not do is to get a person to keep learning . The key is whether an operator keeps learning about their hobby.
When I started in amateur radio, I did not know "come here from sic'em". I have learned over the years...burned myself a few times, gotten shocked a few times, dropped tons of parts from roof tops...all the while learning as I went along. I wish the term appliance operator had never been applied to a beginner. We all had to start somewhere.
Building anything radio related is really fun and the sense of accomplishment can't be beat. Build an antenna and see. Ever run a half square on cb?
Try it some time. It will run you $2or $3 for wire and insulators. Build it, get gain and directional lobes like a beam. Lots cheaper than a commercial antenna. I would not tackle some of the stuff out there, but it is possible to keep learning, experimenting, and plain having fun with radio.
73....de KB5LPA |
707
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 8:20 pm: |
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Ok, perhaps I was a little rough. BUT...I, unlike(apparently) many others, was the kid who always took stuff apart and reveled in tinkering, much to the detriment of many sets of walkie talkies, shortwave radios and CBs. My point being, for example, a transverter is a VERY simple piece of equipment, and the procedure WELL documented in the manual, as it is considered a "level 2" kit, in other words, somewhat intricate, but yet not requiring any test equipment whatsoever besides a simple VOM and a watt meter. I am no radio Einstein, but more of a Frankenstein. My radio past is littered with the carcasses of failed projects. It's all in fun though. Don't get frustrated. My comments are just from the perspective of one who is not afraid to do minor tinkering with a relatively inexpensive piece of gear, in hopes of making it fit my situation.
More power to those who would rather just buy a box and never see the guts. No prob. It's all good... |
707
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 8:37 pm: |
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BTW, just to attract some flameage my way.. I hold only a "Tech" license. |
Alsworld
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 9:49 pm: |
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Buck,
don't give up. I'm a new tech who has been studying morse code throughout the day. It comes slow to me but I'll get there just like you will.
707,
thanks for the reply. Hopefully you can see by Bucks response how sometimes the words of "hams" (generally speaking) can be taken negatively. Hence my response. Hopefully you at least understand the point I was trying to make. I for one have one heck of a time learning electronics and it frustrates me to no end because I want to learn. It just does not come natural. I am learning it though and applying it. I just tinkered with different stuff. I wish there was more choices out there like the old Heathkits that would assist in our (those less electronically inclined) learning curve. After Big Foots post, I did find some kits in my catalogs that look interesting I was not aware existed. Although I can solder, there is a kit designed to teach circuit board soldering. Sounds interesting... I do like getting into the guts of things, love troubleshooting and fixing, and even change my own lawn mower oil (lol!).
Hopefully you understand my point (not that necessarily means I'm correct, just my opinion).
Alsworld |
Buck
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 10:11 pm: |
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I also tore things apart just to see how they worked when I was a kid. But I knew that my parents would buy me more....Now Im alot more conservative because I have to answer to my wife!!!! |
bruce
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 8:36 am: |
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Back when i got my license the way to get on was convert WW2 radios or build. My first station was converted aircraft radios on 2 meter AM and they worked good! My first bought station was a Drake 4 line ( r4b, t4xb, tc-6, tc-2, sc6, sc2, ect ) It was a desaster and spent many trips back to drake i dumped it bought a Yaseu FT-620 which i still have and runs great almost 30 years later! My eyes are bad which limits my abilty to build kits and from scrach but i love taking a radio and revamping it just the way i want.... too bad only ten-tec is out there heath is gone knight kit is gone ....o Buck i know the wife feeling mine is always yelling JUNK MORE JUNK..... I solved that 20 years ago .... YES DEAR! |
Kirk
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 8:55 am: |
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I worked very, very hard to get the license I hold. I admit that sometimes I feel a certain....unjustice maybe...that the FCC decided to lower most of the requirements to certain levels. Some written portions have increased in thre Advanced, Extra but with the dismissal of 12 and 20wpm code I felt like "why did I just work my rear off to get 20wpm??" What I have come to realize though, is that we all have cetain areas we like to work in radio. I do not work CW at all. I still can do 20wpm, but I prefer voice. I don't know everything there is to know, but I like to dabble. It's a nice hobby. I can see 707's point and sometimes I wonder about that situation, BUT.....I think the best thing to do is mentor with as much humility as possible. |
Buck
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 5:59 pm: |
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Yea my wife always tells me to either clean my radio room or she will clean it....needless to say I always jump right up and get cleaning...
Dont worry alsworld Im not going to give up. I enjoy radio too much to do that. I think I'll have a ball in Ham radio |
bruce
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 6:14 pm: |
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Kirk I have always thought the increasing of the code from 13 to 20 was the down fall for the ARRL I have a life membership been a life member for 30 years but few my age are. They remember insentive licenseing and how it stopped the growth of ham radio DEAD it was in 87 when the no code came that the numbers went back up again. The writen test is MUCH harder than it was when i took mine but the whole world of radio has so much more to day than 40 years ago..... heck modulated osc were still leagal on 1296! Code is dieing whether on not we like it lissen on the novice bands they are almost dead. The ARRL is draging its feet on this to apease the older members who cling to the thought that CW will make a big comeback it will not even the milatary has all but abandanded it. Mentoring is ham radios only hope where else will the young find out it even exsists The average of a ham now is 54 and going up in 20 years how many will be left? Hope lies in the ITU changing rules in 2003-2004 this will open up droping code all together which will not happen but could open up ways to increase " TECH " class and allow them to use 12 and 10 meters .... and like i said in 1987 the new one will make great hams too. I know some will not like what im saying but its the truth just look at no code tech and they have no higher rate of violations than any other class. It will get intresting if this happings to see just how much the numbers change
Bruce |
Alsworld
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 6:44 pm: |
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Bruce,
I can understand that for sure. My wife still cannot understand why I want so many radio related things. It's like "what do you mean you will need ANOTHER antenna with that radio your looking at! What's wrong with the five antenna's you have???". lol! I tried once to explain the different frequencies and got shut down. Now it's just "yes dear" as I plan my latest purchases (a new radio with a mobile and base antenna). It must work because I'm 5 for 5 on antenna's and the future looks bright!
Kirk,
I can definetly understand your point on feeling cheated so-to-speak, but I'm afraid the whole world is going that direction. Anything to make our life easier is what earns the biggest dollar. I don't necessarly agree with that philosphy, except it appears to be factual. We (society) want things faster, easier and cheaper but don't want to sweat in the process. It is sad but that is the direction the world has been going for quite some time. Technology has brought us wonderful things, but can never replace the hands of a surgeon (if that makes sense).
Nothing should ever take away what you and other ham's had to work for and earn. But, with cw probably going away in the future, it's something that will have to be dealt with and dropping to five wpm was just the first step. CW is just not used anymore except by amateur radio.
For the record, although I am struggling with it, I wish it would stay.
I do disagree with your "mentor with humility" statement. Some people will learn that way, but I feel it's a much smaller percentage than true effective mentoring by definition. Motivation via humility however can be effective, but that depends on the worth of the ultimate goal to the individual. I don't feel humility belongs in the same sentence as mentoring. And yes, I perform lot's of mentoring on a daily basis.
That is just my opinion and not trying to take away from yours. Your mileage may vary.
Alsworld |
Insider
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 7:55 pm: |
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Yup, I was one of those kids who couldn't keep the covers on anything for very long. Wait, carry that last statement over to the present tense too. Even if I don't touch anything (yeah sure huh) I had to take a peak.
One of the big hilights of my nineth year of existence was getting a cordless phone to make a connection with it's base station from a mile away. It wasn't a very clear connection, nor the most stable, but it was just cool. I confirmed it was my base station by dialing my home number and getting the busy signal--no one else was home at the time.
I did this by putting the base on the second floor and using the longest piece of wire I could find in place of the whip antenna. For the hand set, I was in the attic of my aunt's house and aligator clipped a long wire to the whip on the hand set. Back then I didn't know anything about VSWR and such, all I know for the frequency I was using was "Little antenna bad. Big antenna better." Ha, Ha, Ha... |
Phineas
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 4:45 pm: |
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Once i started getting into home brewing, I have been hooked ever since. I hold a general class license.
IMO, CW doesnt mean squat. Neither does electronics either. You would be surprised at the number of Extra class hams, old and new, that dont seem to know any practical thing about electronics except the theory it took to pass the test. People just get upgrades for status, and to talk to the rest of their club members on HF. Heck, people already do that on CB. All of the most knowledgable people I know in radio are either no-hams, or techs.
As far as learning CW, the best way to learn it is to memorize the letters, find a ham that will get on the radio with you, and just practice sending and copy. Just go as slow as you have to, and build yourself up. If you do this for a month, you will pass the code test easily. It is legal to do CW in any mode, even on CB. Just get a tone generator, and hold the mike up to it. There may even be some of those old channel 14 walkie-talkies that have the morse key on them. Another thing I can recommend is a methed called Code Quick. www.cq2k.com 2 weeks, and you will at least be able to pass. Also look up www.ac6v.com for other tips on passing the code test. It only took me a week, and I was ready to take the test.
At 5wpm, if a person cant pass that, they dont want to bad enough IMHO.
Bruce
You are a better person than I. I am not a big fan of the ARRL. I wish I had a choice of another organization to join. ARRL is a money driven, very political, and is the biggest spreader of propaganda in the ham community. Not to mention the they are the KGB/CIA for the FCC. I wounder who is watching them. The publications are the only thing thats cool about the organization, and you can buy those without being a member.
One last thing. ham radio has turned into a country club. If you dont fit the profile, than you are practicly an outcast. Being fairly new to ham radio, I find little resources for elmering. I had my wife and son(at that time) go to an HRO in LosAngeles to ask about ham radio, and they sent her to a CB store. They didnt even wish to explain anything about ham radio. I didnt get much help hear in St.Louis till after I became a HAM.
Hopefully things will get better when the country club generation SKs. Until then, good luck to all who wish to become hams.
Phineas |
bruce
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 8:34 pm: |
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Phineas your 99% correct on the ARRL and as a life member i have the right to lambast them and do. They have had so many chances to make changes but because the big dollars is riding in the old generation hams they choose to do little or nothing .... in 87 when they supported the no code i thought 100,000 members would die of heart failure! Some have called me a general ( LIGHT ) because i did not take the same test they did so i looked up several of them and found one who was born a year AFTER i was licensed! Since then and i realy dont know why he dosn't talk to me O'well.
Not all act this way i have a delightfull QSO with a 85 year old ham who gave me his history of almost 70 years of ham radio neet guy. With the ITU backing down on code things will change but thats still down the road and 5 WPM just not that hard to learn your right keep trying! |
Phineas
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 1:10 am: |
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General Light...sounds like a new beer...lol
Yeah, they call me a general light also, but after only being a ham a year, very few can hold a a 2" stick to me and what I know about radios now. So much for morse code keeping the riff raff out...lol
Dont get me wrong, you will not meet a finer bunch of people as you will in ham radio. However, the knuckleheads will always make a way to ruin your fun if the can.
Phineas |
bruce
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 7:31 am: |
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I dont beleve the code has much to do with it at all it has detured tech type people much more than rif-raft. Arn't egotiscal people fun there everywhere cb, ham and even in stamp collecting.
These guys never sese to amaze me You have on idea how many fights i've go into just over the no codes. " They will kill the hobbie BREAKER ! BREAKER ! " was the cry. Well except for exam problems the no codes have as good a rscord as any other group. Like i said the ones who bug me the most usaly have been licensed a fairly short time. I was in 17 meters last week talking to the midwest and after i finshed someone called the N9 and told him " I looked him up he is ONLY a general! " The station responded with so what arn't they allowed on 17 meters? So i looked up the bozo who had poped in and found he had a extra issued in July of 2002..... interesting.
To bad i could not track his general license issue date wana bet it is within the last 3 years? Ego trips well give him 40 years to either grow up or give up.
bruce |
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